new ice diving challenge

[popolarbear]

OK, fine guys. I will do a tournament with my self. laps back and forth on a 150ft line.for no other reason than to do it. video record from start to finish thus properly documenting the historical archaeological aspects for all history...or youtube greatest hits at least..the half mile gave me nightmares of all sorts.....stef

[DetectorGuy]

Not trying to hijack the thread, but I will expand the shortened and condensed explanation that Nate gave to dispel any misconceptions you may have. In the last 4 years of being involved with the Isanti County Sheriffs Department Dive Team, We were told that if we supply our own personal dive gear, and it gets damaged during a training dive or a call out, that it would get repaired or replaced by the county. Nate found out that this was not the case when he was called out to attach a tow truck cable to a stolen Lincoln Continental that was fully submerged in the Rum River. Nate ripped his drysuit during the recovery and was told that it will not be covered. This was the first clue that we were not getting what we signed up for.

We were assured that we were covered under the county's insurance. Now, this insurance was not some wild health insurance, or life insurance, infact my personal life insurance premiums doubled as soon as State Farm found out that I was a public safety diver. This insurance we were told we had was to cover us in a civil lawsuit if a family member sued us for not rescuing little Johnny soon enough. The more training a diver goes through, and the more cert cards you have increase your responsibilities (physically and civilly). We had an eye opener to this fact when we went down to the Cannon River in Fairibault to help Rice County locate a 17 year old girl that drown when a car she was in went in the river with 3 of her friends. The search was extensive even before we volunteered to assist with several dive teams, several cadaver dog teams, and even a few psychics. There had been 5,000 man hours in the search and Rice County was running out of resources to continue the search. The family tried to sue for not doing enough to find their daughter. The daughter was found 87 days after going in and the lawsuit was dropped.

With our team members supplying all of our own personal dive gear for training and call outs (with our busiest year having 300 man hours each of combined training and call out hours) the money used for our air, personal dive gear maintenance, and any training that had a cost, would get paid for using donated money from organizations such as the Arctic Plunge Committee and not from the counties coffers. Last Summer the Sheriff asked me to put together an annual budget for the dive team and he would present it to the county board for approval so we would not be solely dependent on donations. The county did not approve the budget for the dive team, the K9 unit and the animal control. The sheriff called and told us in December of 2011 that the dive team has been cut. We told him with the thin ice in the spring of 2012, that we see more of a need to have a dive team than ever and that we would fund the dive team out of our own pocket until funds were available again. He seemed to appreciate this and told us that would be great. I asked him again that if we do this, 'would we be covered under the county's insurance umbrella?' He told me that we are and would continue to be under the county's insurance.

We prepared to cover the 2012 Arctic Plunge with 5,000 people expected to be on 8" of rapidly deteriorating ice, The sheriff banned any of the spectators from being on the ice although the actual plunge would still happen entering the ice hole from shore. A month later the Arctic Plunge Committee invited us to a dinner and told us the we would be receiving a $500 donation to be used for the dive team but this year they would just give us a blank envelope at the dinner so that the donation will not get used for other county programs like the year before. We went to the dinner wearing shirts with the Isanti County Dive Team logo on them and received the blank envelope. The next day I was called in to the sheriffs office, and was told that what we did was illegal. He proceded to tell me that to receive a donation with out the approval of the Sheriff and the county board was against the law. He went on to tell me that the shirts we were wearing at the dinner had some skull and crossbones on them and that they were not approved either. I told him that the logo on the shirts were the same logo as the one he approved a year before and it was the same logo that was watermarked on each page of our Standard Operating Procedure. These shirts were as close to a uniform as we had as we paid for them out of our own pocket. I also told him that the envelope was empty because the donation check that was in last years envelope was earmarked for the dive team was used for other county programs instead of the wireless com gear it was intended for. So with those two issues cleared up between him and I, I asked him if he still wanted us to be the Isanti Count Sheriffs Department Dive Team. He told me absolutely he does. Then I asked him if we are covered under the county's insurance umbrella. He told me without hesitation that we were not covered and we never had been. I told him that each member of the dive team have been risking the loss of everything we own in a potential civil lawsuit for the last 4 years. I told him that this was irresponsible management and that he needs to start looking for new members of the next volunteer dive team. We as a team can do and have done a lot of things exceptionally well, but without insurance I and the team are not willing to risk everything we have ever owned to support our community in a volunteer capacity. We turned in the few items that belonged to the county and now continue in a non public capacity sometimes referred to as the Honey Badger Dive Team.

I hope that clears up any misconceptions you may have had about who we are, and where we are coming from. I did appreciate all the training and experience received while on the team, and I would do it all again in a heartbeat.

John

[Terry]

                     The other day I was driving a 19 ton auger truck thru Isanti Co. with an apprentice following me in my van, I wasn't lost, just not totally sure where I was. I stopped at as intersection and swung the trucks door open to see if my apprentice knew where we going, but something urged me to hold what was left of yesterdays chocolate shake next to the side of my head so the apprentice couldn't see it, and as I leaned out the door pour it all out to appear as if I was ralphing my guts out. I did this really just to mess with my apprentice, because they are so much fun to mess with.
                     After reading John's response, I can see why I was (at least symbolically) urged to ralph my guts out in the middle of Isanti Co. What a sorry excuse of people in charge to tell you (4 years later), that you never were covered. Good point to bring forward John so other PSDs could look into it to see if there in that same Edmund Fitzgerald.

[Hydro]

Lol, people actually use psychics? If they were psychic, maybe they should have warned someone about the accident beforehand. Might as well had a pastor asking poseidon/neptune/chtulhu where the body is.

[Mr.Pitbull]

Wow,

Sorry to hear that guys. It was really worth the read and well spelled out. I hope(?) that it was just a miscommunication and that our government really is not trying to simply deceive us citizens.
What you all have put forth is really remarkable and you have some much time freely given to help the community. So sad that you were all treated that way. It makes it just that much more unlikely that any of the rest of us would volunteer in the future.

--D.

[DetectorGuy]

I didn't want to discourage anyone from wanting to volunteer their time as all circumstances are different. Our demise was basically a loss of trust in our boss. We as a team were gelled together not only by friendship, but trust. That level of trust was, and still is, unmatched where I trust them with my life and they trust me with theirs. That's the way it needs to be. The hard thing is when we have to trust the certain few governmental employees to stand behind their own words. I would highly recommend anyone who is interested to give it a shot. The level of training I received from my buddies can not be learned from any certification I know of. I wouldn't trade the experience for any other.

John

[Mr.Pitbull]

Sorry if I implied your story was discouraging. Just sad how it turned out. As you stated, each situation is different. Most of us on the board are envious of the training that special teams are able to obtain

[grumpie]

      the  special training is out there for anyone if they want to put fore the time and effort to do it. its just like the b-s about the underwater archeology material its out there if  you want it. stop complaining and do some learning. all the bitching and nothing to show for it.

[DetectorGuy]

Its all good!  I am grateful to get the training and experience, but those 4 years were just a stepping stone for bigger and better things. The lessons learned from that chapter can, and will, get applied to the next and more exciting chapter. The difference now is that we will no longer be tied to a wildcard that changes every time the cards are dealt. Now when circumstances outside our control change, all we have to do is improvise, adapt, and overcome based on our decisions and not someone who has never been a diver.

John